Escargot is kind of closed source now

fuck, it might get haxed like phoenix did, due to closed source

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Escargot is much more secure than Phoenix (irreversible password hashes for one), but who knows.

Never thought i’d agree with ICTY until today.

Wait, I just remembered this… but didn’t Anima promise to update the repo with his changes?
EDIT: Yup. He did.


weren’t they a she?

See the last part of this post:

“(and I’m a man, by the way.)”

That’s just silly. I’ll ask you what I always ask “omfg it must be open source otherwise I don’t know what they’re running!!!” people… how do you know we’re running the version which has been released?

People make that assumption, but in reality a lot of services that provide their sources also tend to have their own configuration and plugins they don’t typically make public. It’s not just for chat, but it’s also for things like WordPress, etc.

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First of all, epictaco, thanks for being a big dramatic baby. I’ve said it probably 1,000 times: some parts will be open source (it’s all through the discord and even on this forum), just not right away and not for a while making it effectively not open source for quite a while, and the primary reason is because of people like SxSuri… well, you, among others.

That is to say, people who want to take someone else’s hard work, copy it, set it up, proclaim that they now how their own service and that’s that. Take an issue such as this that we’re working on: federation to avoid people losing their contacts and people they know because they’re talked into joining some other service run by someone who doesn’t realise it takes actual work to do it right and shuts it down after a few months.

A secondary reason is because of how it’s all integrated, which is too much detail to get into, but it’s just not a monolithic hunk of shitty python code anymore, and it can’t be if you want it to run well. I realise some of you get all excited about python, but for a project like this, it’s a terrible, terrible choice and we’re fixing that.

Second it can’t “go” closed source, the sources which exist now will always be available for people like you to fork and do nothing with and pretend they’re saving their world. You’re lying about this, just like you originally lied and said that we violated the license by accepting donations, which if that were true then every open source project is truly screwed.

First of all the FOSS community doesn’t care about Escargot, it could totally disappear tomorrow and nobody would really notice. Second the source is still out there, just not for the new services. And I realise it’s close to Christmas, but you can stop carrying around that cross.

Which is why it has more users now than it did then, I guess they’re all doing it ironically, how cool and hip. Stop trying to save Escargot’s failure, it’s getting so old dude.

I’m not surprised, it’s the kind of thing you do.

And you can all bitch and moan all you want, and hope and pray this destroys the Escargot that you don’t like… but it won’t. The same people will still sign on tomorrow, and the next day, still talk to their friends, and won’t give a flying fuck about the new version being open source so they can pretend it’s some sort of saving grace, won’t care about calling a wambulance for the supposedly offended FOSS community, and life will go on, and you’ll still be here talking about how Escargot is dead, nobody uses it unironically, and it wasn’t what it used to be, and yet it keeps growing.

Enjoy your bubble of delusion fellas, but know that as time goes on, it looks sadder and fucking sadder.

And next time you use a service which has an open source component always ask yourself: are they running the version they’ve released? Because it seems to me that so many of you, evidenced by your posts here and elsewhere, seem to believe in it like it’s a religion, that you take total faith that because RocketChat or whoever is open source, therefore what they’re running is the same code you can look at, yet many of you at the same time will be paranoid about Google.

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the amount of English users has diminished, most of the active post-‘09 escargot users are now copy and pasted Hispanic FNF boyfriend-profile picture 12 year olds who lurk on BitView.

icty (aka European tlwxpuser) is probably one of the OIC’s biggest retards what do you expect, he is one of collabvm’s most hated forkies and only is active on omniarchvie (also known as Minecraft archiving mixed with lolis)

That’s what you find on MessengerGeek anyway. There’s tons of people that are old enough to actually spell proper words.

Escargot never saw many contributions from being open source, and it has had more trouble because it is open source, and it only contributes to a fractured user base. With that, some components of Escargot will be open source.
We plan to be as transparent as possible. If you haven’t noticed, we’re every day working on reworking stuff in order to make it more stable and not actually a bunch of spaghetti code. More information will come soon, but if you think “this is the end of Escargot”, you’re sorely mistaken.


Not since we took over, we’ve mostly enforced a lot of English-only, and the spanish-only crowd, especially young men, has largely either grown up or left. I rarely see this kind of thing any more, but I’ve been around the last 8 months, you haven’t that much. You should come back to the discord, it’s way larger and way different.

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I’ve been trying to distance myself from the OIC as far as possible, and I’m pretty sure there are a few omniarchivians on your community, which would be a recipe for disaster.

omni already fucked my mental health to the point that i don’t even want to eat that much anymore.

Wasn’t proper WLM 8 support, 2009 support, Yahoo! Messenger support, the new website (both the one you made and the one that got replaced), the Messenger Plus! sound server, the text ad system, games and activities, etc all contributions from the community/developers that were once community members? Or at the very least, helped in a big way by the community (pretty much the same definition but yeah :p). You were also a countributor (found lost installers for WLM 8 in different languages, the new site which was being worked on long before you were a developer, helping with merging the site changes for that update, etc).

Most, if not all of the lazily hosted Escargot forks just crashed and burned in favor of the real deal anyway.

That’s a nice change. Please do.

Not really. Most of the userbase are pretty good English speakers, and I believe only a few are actually in the OIC.

Giving credit where credit is due, you and Tony are talented programmers and you two are really doing a great job at stabilizing the service.

These were all implemented by already settled developers (valtron and walkingphasers). It wouldn’t matter if it was open source or not. I didn’t contribute that much back then, and that last thing about merging changes was only because the person in charge of it didn’t have basic git skills, something they should have anyway, and I just pressed buttons and figured out what needed to be merged, nothing more. The installers didn’t contribute to the code at all.

We’re pretty transparent to our donators, and they get this information first, considering they help us host the service. This information is eventually relayed to everyone else.

Thanks, but knowing how to program isn’t enough, you have to know how to run a service too, what’s the best course of action, and we don’t do stuff without any prior thinking, if something happens on Escargot it happens for a reason.

What I’d do is give everyone the same information, but the donators get more details about it, while everyone else gets a summary of it. This is just personal preference however.

That’s true. Running a service by just winging it and having no idea what you’re doing is a recipe for disaster

Everyone gets the same information. Donators just get it first.

I know. Here, let me explain.
Everyone gets the same information at the same time, but donators get it in more detail (i.e: explaining how you did X and the steps you did to achieve it), while normal users just simply get “we did X.” Again, this is just a personal preference of mine :p.

We actually do that too. The basics are shared with both, but in the development channel and also on our Patreon stream we detail a lot more, especially in the discord, a lot more technical detail. As we’re working on things, however, we talk in our development channel first, partly because they’re donors, and partly because it avoid unintended hype around things.

If we speak publicly that we’re working on X, people will expect it tomorrow and ask about it every damn day, but if we give progress on X to donors, we can get some feedback with the understanding it’s privileged information until we deem it’s the right time to put it in the announcements channel.

You could hold off onto the announcement until it’s almost complete, or say that it’s TBD on when it’s coming, but yeah that’s true.

oh yeah about that

does the FOSS community really give a shit about escargot? No. I’ve literally haven’t made anyone in the FOSS community mad (this does not count omni) back when I closed source squareBracket over internet drama.

most if not nearly all revivals out there are closed source, the only one I can think of that’s open source is subrocks and apparently some xfire thing.

ok so I was a retard by saying that. yes, the wlm ‘09 launch had some painful issues at launch, but compared to then escargot isn’t a spaghetti pile of code anymore and it crashes way.

i still don’t get icty regardless. why the fuck does he have a fetish of “EvEryThInG ShOuLd bE OpeN SouRcE!!11? Back when squareBracket was open source (yea, shitty shameless plug), i kept stressing over what will the guys at SubRocks think about my code, when I closed source that shit, i literally didn’t have to worry about that anymore. yes, they laughed and laughed, but at the end I didn’t care.